Bringing the 'gods' back?

(Felix Gonzalez) #1

So i am thinking of bringing the ‘gods’ back in my home campaign at Epic Tier (4e), at least temporarily. I was thinking the Ancient Egyptian pantheon.
Perhaps the remaining ‘gods’ decide to come back from across the Grey for what ever reason (maybe to try and take back the material plane, killing a few SK’s in the process). I would imagine that they would be severely weakened with out a connection to the outer planes.
Either way i need ideas for how to handle this, so i am asking you fellow Athasians.
Such as whys and hows, what pantheon, and so on? Or what ever, just let loose with ideas.

P.S. Yes i know, many may be thinking “but that would ruin the setting!”, but all i want to know is if you were to do it, HOW would you do it?

Many thanks in advance!

Edit: Would you do this pre or post PP?


Tear away the Gray. The Gray is the obstruction so removing that would bring gods.

(Felix Gonzalez) #3

Indeed, but what do you think would happen if that happened?
Going with the the assumption of the Pharaonic Pantheon, what if Ra put up the Gray as a last defence against all of creation being consumed by Apophis?
And as a side question: How would that effect undead?

Edit: Or Greek, perhaps the Olympians put it up to protect themselves from the Titans (Primordials?), kind of assuming 4e’s philosophy.
What would you do if it was one of the more traditional pantheons from the FR or Oerth?
I need ideas, as i am kind of without any idea what i would do. I want to challenge the players expectations, maybe they have to push the ‘gods’ back to the outer planes or to put the Grey back up. It is for Epic Tier so it needs to be big, and yet not about plane hopping. I want to keep it on Athas.

Lol got to hate it when your mind can’t think things up fast enough, which is why i am asking you guys.

By the way, HI to the community! Just discovered the site and got signed up yesterday, love it, lots of neat ideas going around! Finally found a place to post this question! :smiley:


You could just steal the history of the Old Empires from FR. You could even use the Orcgate Wars as your follow-up.

(Andrea Ferrari) #5

I’d do it post PP. If you keep Dregoth Ascending as canon, one of the possible ending (instead of an anticlimatic “it didn’t work”), could be that Dregoth’s Godhood Spell managed to create a breach to the Grey, allowing access to the Outer Planes and giving Gods the power to manifest their powers on Athas.

(Felix Gonzalez) #6

Will have to look up the Old Empires and the Orcgate Wars.
That is a neat idea Hades! I just recently read Dregoth Ascending and found it intriguing. Are there any any books i should read to help me with my PP lore? I got the Beyond the PP and the Revised Setting, are there any other good post-PP books?

And one last question.
What to you think the gods would do, and how would the remaining SK’s react to the gods?

Thanks guys!

(Andrea Ferrari) #7

Of course the best thing to do to know PP lore is reading the books :wink:
But even the products are set in a Post-PP setting, so you’d have enough information with them.

Of the remainig SKs, both Hamanu and The Oba claim to be gods and demand workship. So I think they’d prohibit “true gods” workship in Urok and Gulg. Nibenay, on the other hand, doesn’t claim to be a god and, being the scholary one, may be interested in studying why the god came to Athas (and maybe, he’d start research to become one of them).

The gods imho would start to find workshippers (maybe contacting “chosen ones” via dreams or such means), granting cleric powers (not elemental cleric, but “standard” cleric powers). So if you go by 3.5 rules you could still use the cleric class, but with “standard domains”. Pterran worskhip the Earth Mother, so I think that a nature deity may choose them as the first workshippers.

(Felix Gonzalez) #8

Okay, wow! Thank you for the detailed reply! Lots of material to work off of, in so few words! Definately going to look into getting the books.

What do you think the Avangions (Korgunard and Oronis) and the Pyreen would do?
I know so little about their personalities, where can i read up on the Avangions? I know Korgunard is featured in the Dragon’s Crown adventure and earlier… but Oronis?

P.S. Just realized i know almost nothing about the pyreen… what book discusses them?

I think that is all my questions!
Thank you all! :heart:

(Andrea Ferrari) #9

Korgunard died in Dragon Crown adventure (but he can be alive and well in your campaign, or the could’ve resurrected him). I think that an Avangions or Pyreens would try to contact a good deity with the hope thats he/she’s able to restore Athas to a better state.

Pyreens are described in the first Dark Sun monster compendium: Terrors of the Desert. Basically they’re druid/psioncisit that want to restore Athas. In the Expanded Boxed Set we discover that they’re the the remnants of the last of the nature masters, Rhulisti of great power that transformed into Pyreen at the end of the Blue Age.

Rajaat is NOT an average Pyreen, of course :slight_smile:

(Felix Gonzalez) #10

Okay, many thanks. Now that brings Rajaat into question. Is he still alive, in the Hollow or otherwise?

Really need to study my PP lore.


Edit: Might just look it up myself… i think releasing him on the party and the ‘gods’ would be fun and interesting. Maybe he even makes a temporary alliance with Set… Muahahaha! >:D


Rajaat as a Pyreen is one of the reasons that I dislike the revised box set.

(Andrea Ferrari) #12

I prefer the 1st Boxed set, too, but I’m cool with Rajaat as a Pyreen. To me it makes him a sort of “fallen angel”. I dislike the revised boxed set for the fact that almost all the SKs are killed like peons by a bunch of mid level jackasses with deus-ex items and powers (for instance, it makes no sense that the Scourge makes the wielder immune to the Champions’ powers. It should make the wielder immune to DWARVES’ powers).

Post PP Rajaat is still “alive” (I think he’s just impossible to kill him), but he’s trapped.

(Felix Gonzalez) #13

Yeah, i kind of dislike it too. But ‘HEY!’ the DM can pick and choose what parts s/he wants to use or change, right?

(Andrea Ferrari) #14

Indeed :wink:

My favourite part of the PP by far is when Hamanu kicks the crap of Rikus and the Crimson Legion at the end of the second book without breaking a sweat. That’s the only time in all the 5 books when a Sorcerer King is depicted as powerful as he SHOULD be.

And I think that the designers understood that the largest part of the fandom preferred the first iteration of Dark Sun. The Dungeon Magazine version is set in a future that “restored” the Age of SKs (Andropinis is back, Azetuk became Tec 2.0, etc.), while the 4ed version simply is set when just Kalak died, ignoring the rest of the PP.

For example Dregoth is one of my favourite Dark Sun characters, and he’s from the “post PP era”.

(Felix Gonzalez) #15

Jackasses! HA! Could not have put it better! Have not yet read the books, but… Sadira sounds like one!

By the way many thanks Hades for your help and patience!

(Felix Gonzalez) #16

Now that sounds like a very enjoyable scene to read (not to sound sadistic). Always thought Hamanu sounded like a badass, always thought of him kind of like Bane.
Am i thinking of him in the wrong way in this regard?

Think i will head over to the topic on the SK’s personalities…

(Andrea Ferrari) #17

That’s the perfect example. The whole arcane magic in Dark Sun is divided between preserving and defiling. The harder, rigorous pact that is not destructive to the environment and the easier, but “darker” pact.

And… boom, this “sun wizard” crap that has awesome powers that brings no harm to the environment, and of course only she, the special snowflake, can use. And even before that she was full of “invincible plot armor”: she’s no psionicist, yet she was able to defeat Nok (who was depicted as superior to Agis, a master of the Way) in a psionic combat.

And let’s just remember how she acquired that power… A mid level wizard in a quick trip to the Pristine Tower became that awesome Sun Wizard, able to wield magic more powerful than the freakin Dragon’s. The Champions, otoh, were trained by Rajaat for ages, then they were empowered by him (not by his servants) with the powers of both the Pristine Tower and the Dark Lens.

That’s why the Sun Wizard’s powers, the “immunity to champion sword”, etc to me are just “deus-ex”.

Ok, sorry about my rant :sweat_smile:

(Andrea Ferrari) #18

“When Tyr is ashes, then you have my permission to die, Rikus” (ok, I just needed to write that XD)

Yes, Hamanu may be something like Bane (the Dark Knight Rises and the comic book version, when he’s as intelligent as he’s strong). Depicting himself as a warrior king who trains his troops first hand, he’s a sort of “genius bruiser”.

I havent’t red it yet, but Raise and Fall of a Dragon King is a novel based upon Hamanu. The book is widely regarded as “not canon”, but I think it can be a nice font of inspiration for anyone who wanna know more about the Lion of Urik.

(Felix Gonzalez) #19

Yeah, she sounds like more of the selfish/greedy type in regards to Nok’s stick (artifact?). Too bad she did not get scratched in the Pristine Tower, eh? Either way, she only wields that power during the day, right? My players will be right quick to discover that weakness, then ‘nighty night Sadira’! XD

(Felix Gonzalez) #20

Will get that book (if i don’t that i have it already).
Yeah, have not kept up with Batman since before the Dark Knight… so i was referring to the ‘god’ of war, Bane. Though you sparked my interest for the new Bane. :smile: