Not a good idea because of more work? It ain’t like WotC is giving any thought into the setting right now. We have time for the para-elemental plane of hematite if we wanted. @redking
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Folks, I’ve had a few ideas I’d like to bounce off of you guys for my Mindmage Ascendancy campaign. They touch on the conundrum of the cosmology surrounding Athas.
Remember these are my views and may not necessarily be consistent with anyone else’s views. I’ve tried to marry the inconsistencies in various books that you have discussed here to come up with a generic explanation without doing too much of a deep dive.
Here goes.
Mindmage Ascendancy Campaign Notes (PFRPG/5e)
Extradimensional and Interplanar Travel and Communication Difficulties on Athas
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Some calamity that occurred eons ago knocked Athas off its metaphysical alignment, disrupting its connection to the rest of the cosmos, leaving disjointed and tattered tethers connecting the world to the planes. Some planar connections were completely severed, while others became twisted reflections of themselves due to a lack of primal connections with the rest of their cosmic existence.
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Athas’ planar alignment with the known universe is unlike other worlds. A planar anomaly Athasians call the Gray, forms a metaphysical barrier around the world. In certain areas it intertwines itself with the world and the ethereal plane, at times separately or conjoined with each other. This barrier is near-impenetrable and prevents travel or communication to the outer planes and makes travel to the inner planes extremely difficult. How it came to be no one knows, but when Athasians die their spirits come here with no ability to move beyond, lingering until they are absorbed into the ether of the Gray.
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To add to the convoluted nature of the planes surrounding Athas, there is a cold, dark shadowy plane that resides deep in the Gray and yet its tendrils reach into the very shadows of Athas. This strange planar dimension is known as the Black where in one moment, the landscape mimics that of Athas and in another it becomes unfamiliar and indistinct. It is said that strange creature’s both big and small dwell here, some bearing the vague likenesses of creatures long gone from the face of Athas, others are formless, angry dead with a malevolent sentience in search of prey. Those that travel into this realm are confident in their might or foolhardy to the extreme.
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Powerful psions, wizards and clerics can use their spells and abilities to travel to the elemental planes, some even dare to venture deep into the Gray searching for a connection beyond. What most find are strange hulking monstrosities with an insatiable hunger or spirits that have retained some measure of power and lead travelers astray. Some claim to have seen mysterious and indistinct structures cocooned within the impenetrable ether. Because of this and other strange things, planar and extra-dimensional travel is difficult and fraught with danger.
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Strangely enough, the difficulties in using psionic or magical travel does not extend to those abilities that use the natural elements found on Athas. Spells such as wind walk and teleport via plants and other similar spells or psionic abilities all work normally. However, when attempting psychoportation, arcane teleportation abilities or any ability that touches on the astral or ethereal planes issues arise.
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Teleportation or other extradimensional travel spells are reduced in their ability to travel long distances due to the interference this tangle of planar fabric has caused. Only true masters of arcane or psionic travel can manage to attempt these distances. Even for these skilled individuals there is a risk of a failed or erroneous travel. Less skilled individuals who try to use these modes of travel end up with deadly or debilitating consequences. Because of this any such spells and psionic abilities are reduced in effectiveness in the following ways:
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Any spells or psionic abilities that use extradimensional travel methods such as teleport or dimension door are reduced to a tenth of the range that is normally possible (e.g. teleport range goes from 100 miles per level to 10 miles per level)
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Caster/Manifesters use the table below when attempting extradimensional travel
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| Familiarity | Mishap | Similar Area | Off Target | On Target |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Permanent circle | — | — | — | 01-100 |
| Associated object | 01-05 | 06-10 | 11-25 | 26-100 |
| Very familiar | 01-10 | 11-20 | 21-35 | 36-100 |
| Seen casually | 01-20 | 21-40 | 41-60 | 60-100 |
| Viewed once | 01-50 | 51-60 | 61-75 | 76-100 |
| Description | 01-60 | 61-75 | 76-85 | 86-100 |
| False destination | 01-50 | 51-100 | — | — |
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Spells that contact the outer planes, such as legend lore are answered by powerful beings or spirits residing on these planes, never crossing to the outer planes.
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Spells that summon creatures like summon monster or Gate only summon or call wispy gray-skinned replicas of these creatures who may display different abilities than their normal counterparts. With the right components elemental creatures can manifest in a specific creature’s stead, these elementals are similar in form and power as the desired creatures.
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Spell durations for summoned creatures is halved.
Thanks for reading and commenting
June
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I’m agnostic on much of what you posted June (I’m not up to speed with 5E or PF 2E). I would say the teleport/travel rules are just cruel and capricious. Most of the spells/powers you’re talking about are 5th level or above, meaning you need a mid-level character to even have a chance of use them. Teleport in 1st to 3rd Editions already has a failure chance. Teleport without Error/Greater Teleport doesn’t (but then its a 7th level spell). If PCs are taking teleport family spells that’s one less offensive spell they can take (cone of cold, prismatic spray etc) so they’re already paying a price.
Sometimes underlying concepts need to be bent to allow cool things to happen. If you’re really set on not letting your players teleport around Athas (which I’m assuming is your plan, rather than just casually killing PCs for poor dice rolls), just get rid of the spells/powers. Either rule they don’t exist in your campaign, or make it so they never find a copy of the spell.
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Thanks for the advice. My intent overall was to marry up all of the different publications on the extraplanar and intraplanar status of Athas in non-mechanical game (non-edition) terms in the first 4 bullets.
The the next few bullets were a way for me to justify limiting the various teleportation spells to keep one of Dark Sun’s tropes (wasteland survival) going a little longer and as well as explaining why the armies don’t use any interdimensional wormholes to invade the cities. But you gave me some perspective that I hadn’t thought of. Much appreciated.
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When exactly did the “cutting off” of Athas occur? I had the impression of it being a recent event, but perhaps canon would disagree with me?
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I think that’s the problem to your question: there really isn’t a canon answer. Things are a mess from the very beginning.
My thoughts are:
The cutting off is basically a failsafe device to ensure PC’s, NPC’s or anything else for that matter cant use the planes or other worlds or Spelljamming to flood the Athas with metal weapons or other equipment making one of the primary tropes of Dark Sun - the lack of natural resources- irrelevant.
I mean even Dregoth having access to the Planar Gate is problematic. Just a few jaunts to the other planes and he would have all the metal he needs to annihilate his enemies on Athas (why he would come back is another issue - unless you go with Dregoth Ascending adventure premise)
When it happen or if it ever happened or maybe perhaps it has always been is another story.
It’s kinda like the debate of whether Athas ever had gods or not.
WJ - described temples in the ruins, many temples in large ruined cities and of course its in the novels as well. There are ancient undead that followed some gods and still exist powered by their faith in something. The explanation below are satisfying as some part of the written world contradict each of them.
- The gods went silent or died no one knows why or how
- The gods never existed, Athas doesnt have whatever it is it needs to have gods.
- Ancient peoples worshipped the elementals mistakenly attributing gods were really the elementals (in which case they would still exist) and the ancients were just ignorant for all those millennia.
- Make up what ever you want or use a combination of the above.
There is no lore to it, just conjecture you can make from previously published articles and products.
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Dregoth would not remain on Athas given the alternative paths he could take. That is the entire premise of my short stories about Dregoth living in Sigil. I am going to continue these short stories, by the way. Dregoth is going to meet a real deity.
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Lol Only if you accept my theory that Dregoth is actually only 24th level1 
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Blockquote
Dregoth’s pride and thirst for vengeance against the other SKs keeps him on Athas. He also wants to be an uncontested deity which he wouldn’t be anywhere other than Athas.
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I like the idea that Athas was sealed off by the gods when they imprisoned the Primordials there. Like the Greek myth about Tartarus and the Titans.
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Now that’s something I’d love to read (and I love your planar short stories already)!
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I introduced an aasimar npc who came to Athas seeking vengeance against Dregoth for killing her planetar father during his time in the Outer Planes.
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Found this about darksun planes while searching for something else:
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There are canon works that allow plane shifting, I recently was pointed to Black Spine, which obviously shows that Githyanki and Githzerai can planeshift on Athas. Psionics wouldn’t even be a thing on Athas unless they could tap into the Astral Plane, don’t believe the so called purists that say planar travel is impossible. They are Pharisees, clinging to rules and regulations created by themselves…
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What does psionics have to do with the Astral Plane?
Psionics: The psionicist shapes, controls, harnesses, and utilizes natural forces that infuse his own being. His effort is focused inward rather than outward. He must be completely in touch with and aware of even the tiniest workings of his body and mind. pg 8 CPHB
It is the plane of the mind. I don’t remember the book that mentioned it, but you could actually enter someone’s mind that was a high level psionic through the Astral Plane. It is where the mind taps into the psionic powers from what I have read.
Wasn’t there mention in one of the Planescape books about how trying to enter Athas’ crystal sphere would result in a chance of randomly ending up lost the Grey?
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I haven’t seen that. But I’m sure it’s possible if you are not using a dedicated teleportation circle.
On my other point of the Astral Plane, it has to be able to be accessed before the Grey, if the Grey blocks access to other planes as many people surmise the Grey to be. Because psionics would not work properly on Athas, if that were the case. And as we know, almost everything is psionic on Athas, so it stands to reason that the Astral Plane (or at least a smaller demi plane of the Astral) is closer to Athas than any of the other planes.
Yes. I believe it was a percentile roll. There is also the locality of ‘New Tyr’ in the Sigil slums.
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Web DM has a great video about the Astral Plane and describes at one point that psionic warriors fight both on the Astral and the Material at the same time.
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