Prism Pentad Continuity Issues: Nok, Giants, and Floating Heads

On my first reading of ‘The Verdant Passage’ I had initially believed them to be undead. But after completing the Prism Pentad I realized that the only reason that I had believed them to be undead was because it was inconceivable to me that someone could be a head removed from its body and remain alive. Its clear to me that Sacha and Wyan are alive, but cursed and split from much of their power. It would probably take an epic spell to restore them.

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You have a point. Sadira did cast a detect magic spell and said it didn’t feel like regular sorcery though she was far from being an expert at that point. While Agis on the other hand was nearly a master psionicist so he makes a stronger case.

Another scenario could be that the heads showed Tithian to a scroll or other item to create that effect. Something that he needed them to guide him on proper usage. Perhaps they had warned him using the item without them might damage his body or mind in some way?

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Just throwing it out there regarding nok, maybe he isn’t a halfling at all, but something disguised as one, perhaps a pyreen, though its still doesn’t explain his use of dragon magic…

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I think the easiest way to deal with Nok is to assume he didn’t create the cane. This was perhaps an artifact his tribe had since the cleansing wars. After all the only feats we actually see him do revolved around creating the Heartwood spear. When he told Sadira not to try to use his own magic against him. He might have been denoting possession rather than creation. Sort of like how his warriors are his because they belong to him. He didn’t create his tribe he’s just it’s current ruler.

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Intersting point, but that still leaves the question of who did creat the cane. As for me, im inclined to believe that he created it by himself, but i do like the cane as a relic possesd by his tribe for generations

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A vestige/servant of Rajaat himself? That would be crazy, implementing actions that eventually led to his release and not expecting the heroes to have gained as much strength as they did?

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The explanations for Nok are getting pretty wild.

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Yeah, I know. I’m not sure what to think.

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Oh I don’t know. On the Dark Sun heresy front I like the headcanon of Nok being an aspiring Dragon himself who uses animal life force rather than plant. That’s why he’s worried about Kalak potentially migrating to the Forest Ridge if he ascends to Stage X - competition concerns rather than worries about the loss of the forest.

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Nok never seemed particularly altruistic to me. He never came across as a servant of the forest. It was more like he was the ruler of the forest. The forest was his domain. If you swear your life to the forest you are essentially swearing your life to obey Nok.

It seems to me Nok wanted the forest preserved from Kalak so that he could continue to rule it.

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Some random thoughts.

What if “Nok” wasn’t actually a name but a title like pharaoh passed down through the ages. Could be the current Nok believes he’s the reincarnation of some forest god.

Somewhere down the line “a Nok” (who may not of been halfling) created the cane which has been passed down through generations of Noks.

If looked as mantle could explain the life-draining ability. Rather than a class ability, its one granted by the forrest itself to the Nok.

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Well, my wife plays a halfling mage in our game :rofl: though her character has a kind of funny backstory, and halfling mages are very rare rather than non-existent in our Athas, inspired by Nok.

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“Nok was a high level mage/psionicist/druid, which gave him the equivalent of Preserver dragon magic (at a very low level).” -quoted from Troy Denning by “Lukasz” 2/01/05

It’s true. Troy Denning posted once in the mailing list IIRC and so I got his email. I asked some questions and he was super nice but he seemed kind of" out of touch" with the setting during the time, that was my impression. I asked him for example if there were 13 champions and 13 races they were tasked to exterminate. He said yes but when I asked for their names and the races, he said that he made notes but doesn’t know or has access to them. Those are just the things i remember.
I might have all my mails, and those from the 90ties mailing list on my external hard drives, CDs or the iomega zip disks but I don’t have a compatible hardware i think. Should I be in Munich again, i will take them with me and check it out.

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So I found the Dark Sun Mailing list Archives, some from 1994, 1995, most from 1996. It´s a mess unpacking and opening them. I can´t yet find my old private mails.

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My goodness. I believe these words are my own… from 2005 or so I would venture. And yet they are summoned here. I believe this was from an age when redking and Sysane and others debated and speculated over the Champions and other great heroes in great detail. Fascinating time.

As to the odd original quote from Lukasz, indeed, as I recall I too looked for an original derivation, and even then I could not find it. There was only the derivative unsourced quote from Lukasz.

Enjoyable discussions, these. I believe I stand by my original words on the matter, though redking and I elucidated at great length on these subjects once upon a time, and my expanded (and prolix) thoughts on such subjects may still be floating out there, somewhere…

I tip my hat to you BDmdragon for conjuring this nugget from the Gray.

Respectfully,

-Phaaf Glien

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Since I am this Lukasz from the old Mailing List :smiley: I can assure you that I indeed send Troy Denning an mail and that he was kind enough to answer. Mind you, questions were mostly about Champions, Nok, the Split Rock and other things I can´t remember now.

Oh yes, I asked him if Agis survived iirc because I couldn´t accept his death, he said something like “no, he didn´t, because Athas is that harsh” or something along those lines, or was it on twitter? Damn, once you live for some decades time becomes blurry.

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Ha. That’s awesome MindCosmos! Then verily, I hold this ancient business confirmed. Excellent.

I myself have generally sided with this “mage/psionicist/druid” business, and have long upheld this general view in my campaigns. Ultimately I don’t think Mr. Denning was overly concerned with game mechanic principles, especially when it came to Nok. It is pedantic folk like me who stress over his class, level and precise nature. Ha. But it is an enjoyable discussion.

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I agree with you, story > rules. The rules didn’t make much sense sometimes, so why not bend or break them. Dregoth reaching level 29 without a Dragon rage, ok.
Besides, Nok could have been a Illusionist/Psionicist/(Druid) with (or against) the multiclass rules and with high enough stats he could’ve made it to level 21 against all odds, a true forest bird (avangion).

I also liked the idea of Avangions needing Obsidian orbs, maybe many smaller, grown into their wing if high level, to drain the life force of living beings in order to cast spells. They would do it in a sensitive way and the beings could regenerate completely, or if used too extensively, they would age slightly, like Agis did.

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I’m going to suggest something that’s a bit out there- what if Nok isn’t a full blooded halfling? What if Somewhere along hs family tree one of his ancestors got involved with a member of the Rebirth races(like Sorak’s parents), giving him the necessary mutations to wield arcane magic and psionics?

This also works well with Rajaat choice to use humans as his champions. He could’ve bred the mutations into his halfling servants or splice the mutation into their DNA to give them magic, but that would mean “tainting” them since he believed the Rebirth and everything that had to do with it was a mistake.

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If we are going to get whacky on the theories, what if Nok (a cannibal halfling) feasted on the flesh of a metamorphosed dragon or avangion, thereby gaining its powers?

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