Hi all. (Long time lurker, first time poster.)
I’ve been working with my playtest crew on a set of revised rules for 2E psionics. It’s largely built off of the Will and the Way / Skills and Powers, but with revisions to fix the action economy, align it with other 2E mechanics, and constrain the psionic powers in a way that works to preserve Dark Sun’s narrative constraints.
Curious to know what people think – feel free to use at will, obviously – and any comments are very much appreciated!
Welcome to the Arena!
Thanks! Athas.org is such a fantastic resource.
Welcome! Glad to have you around!
Fwiw, I’m sure that others have commented this elsewhere, but the core reason for building these rules was that the psionics RAW (in either S&P or PsiHand) doesn’t work – a) it costs more to attack than to defend, so the Nash is do nothing and b) nearly all of the psychoportation powers (and a host of others) break what is interesting about Dark Sun in terms of environmental / resource constraints around travel. Psionicists become a different type of spellcaster, but one without the consequences, which seems setting inappropriate given how core psionics is supposed to be to the narrative. Duels in the fiction are also relatively quick and dramatic, and I wanted to try to capture that spirit while mapping to 2E combat mechanics.
Psionics should feel both natural to Athas and a mental extension of what is physically possible, rather than another type of arcane magic. On a low-magic, low-tech dying earth world where magic is destructive (defilers = serial killers + toxic waste emitters), psionicists make up your professional class. That is, more like mental versions of NFL defensive ends, ER surgeons, and trial lawyers and less like wizards in bondage gear.
To that end, I’ve seen other schema on here - but I mostly borrowed from Julian May (and thinking about the Rhulisti’s bio-tech) in making five disciplines: Kinesis (most of PK), Creation (some of PK, inanimate Psychometabolism), Life-Shaping (organic Psychometabolism / medical Telepathy), Farsensing (most of Clairsentience), and Control (most of Telepathy), nerfing or removing all of the powers that I felt were setting breaking, and ringing the disciplines so that Kinesis and Control are opposed and Creation and Life-Shaping are opposed, creating natural tensions / schools / trade-offs for PC psionicists.
I would be curious to discover what the original author was thinking back when the RPG rules were approved versus the novels, and how much input / influence there was in both directions.
I take the view that the rules are official (since they were authorized), and while they may not have all shown up in the novels, they are still the full scope of what psionics are capable of for all forms of Dark Sun.
I also take the view that psionics should remain distinct from magic, and even if the end result of a given effect or set of effects may coincide when comparing magic and psionics, the path taken to get there (and the levels and methods involved) should usually be different.
Though, I would like to clarify that I am less interested in who is “right” (that would be the authors / IP holders, in any case), and more interested in the thought processes and analysis of how the various conclusions were reached for each power that was viewed as problematic.
My approach targets a more “bio-mental environmental adaptation paths” and “meta-rule alterations informing historical modifications by civilizations” set of view points.
These approaches, instead of judging if a power fits the setting or not, assumes the conceit that all powers listed exist somewhere in the setting (especially given the very large amount of the planet that remains unknown), and seeks to discover where and how they might fit. In cases of poorly worded or defined sections (an unfortunately frequent event with TSR and WotC), developing usable rules for every case are the goals.
If you would be interested in posting here a power you modified and/ or a power you cut, I would be interesting in learning about your process of analysis and development.
While this is technically true, I don’t think it matters as much in the CompPsi version, because you don’t have to batter down their PSPs, just hit them three times (get three tangents). And they can do that in one and a half rounds against a fellow psionicist.
Psychic Combat is the realm of the Telepath; other psionicists learn to defend against it (the automatic defense mode acquisition), but for a lot of them, it is better to run up and punch the telepath, because the telepath will trounce them in psychic combat… just like it’s better for the telepath to try to subvert their opponent’s will, rather than run up and punch them.
A CompPsi telepath is likely going to start with Contact and Mindlink (the core of their discipline), and two other powers… one of them is probably an attack mode, though if they want to limit it to non-psionicists, they can probably get away without one for now. Non-Telepaths can’t attack in psionic combat until 5th level (at which point, they’ll be able to take Mindlink, which is necessary for the attack modes), and that’s only if they’ve built themselves up to that point, taking at least Contact and one other Telepathic Devotion in levels 2, 3, or 4.
Until 5th level? All a non-telepath can do is defend themselves and punch the Teep in the face. After 5th level? All they can do is defend themselves and punch the Teep in the face, unless they’ve specifically built themselves into a Teep-lite.
Though, I would like to clarify that I am less interested in who is “right” (that would be the authors / IP holders, in any case), and more interested in the thought processes and analysis of how the various conclusions were reached for each power that was viewed as problematic.
Until 5th level? All a non-telepath can do is defend themselves and punch the Teep in the face. After 5th level? All they can do is defend themselves and punch the Teep in the face, unless they’ve specifically built themselves into a Teep-lite.
Thanks both Nijineko and LibraryOgre. At the risk of being pedantic - but we’re having a rules discussion about a more than thirty-year old game text, so I assume we’re all sinners together here - following JL Austin’s formulation of errors being divisible into mistakes (you achieved what you are trying to do, but that action has unintended negative consequences) and accidents (you failed at what you were trying to do in the first place), I think that TSR’s original psionic combat framework is just an accident. It needs correction like a typo needs correction, and its fault is structural. Whereas the inclusion of most psychoportation powers was an intentional mistake - TSR achieved what it was trying to do - but didn’t conceive of how that would break Dark Sun.
Accident:
“The telepath wins psychic combat, everyone else should punch the telepath” is a concession that the original system’s psionic combat is DOA (though agree that my point about the PSP imbalance is from the later attempted revisions). Still, there was a reason they were trying to redo the mechanics from the original CompPsi / Boxed Set! TSR built a system where the optimal strategy for 80%+ of psionicists is “don’t use a signature class feature”; and I disagree that it even works for the Teeps. Granting the scenario you note, LibraryOgre, with Teep vs. Teep, getting three tangents still requires hitting three times AND beating the opponent’s defense. If every psionicist takes Tower of Iron Will at first level (players choice as a defense, doesn’t count against powers), even at 1st level, they have at worst a +4 on the power check relative to an attacker, assuming equal Wisdom (that versus Ego Whip; this ranges from +4-+6 taking the Psionic Combat Attack/Defense Table and combining with each power’s modifier), and at worst a -4 PSP/round difference (vs Mind Thrust). Against Psionic Blast, ToIW is +5, +5). So the defender has substantially favorable table odds – achieving each tangent is only ~20-30% for a high Wis Teep vs. a even a low-level high Wis Teep. Everyone at the table is watching two players roll dice hoping they overcome the inertia. The average round for a third tangent is the 6th round of psionic combat? That just can’t be what TSR intended, especially given the fictional vibe they were aiming to replicate. TSR wanted dramatic mental duels: with narrative attack modes, defense modes, the grid of interacting modifiers and the math let them down. (And a lack of playtesting.)
So my system addresses the action economy first. Fwiw, psionic attack is still the province of my Controllers (Teeps, in your framework); it’s just much more action oriented and attack favored.
Mistake:
The inclusion of the Psychoportation powers strikes me as an easy mistake to fix, though puzzling to have made. So as an example per your (“a power you cut”), I cut all of them (except for Dimensional Blade). Per canon, Athas is isolated from other crystal spheres and most planes. Also transportation on Athas is supposed to be difficult, constrained by geography, climate, and resources. Caravans are often enormous and slow moving, with a substantial part of their cargo load spent on feed/water. Now, imagine the Psychoportive psionicist. In CompPsi rules, they have min 20 PSP + 10 PSP per level (and more likely something like 25 PSP + 12 PSP per level). S&P is a little less. Either way, by level 9, they can teleport themselves and two other people 100 miles instantaneously (or themselves 200 miles), and then do so again the following day ad infinitum. Or at 1st level, for 20 PSP, a psionicist can take an entire party of adventurers 100 miles with Dream Travel. With the Will of the Way’s new power, Wormhole, she can take an entire caravan 100 miles through a gate for ~100 PSP. When combined with Convergence it stretches belief that there are not more Wheel of Time style transports of entire armies from city to city; Athas as it exists doesn’t permit this type of high fantasy/high magic environment. I agree with you, Nijineko, that one of the attractive things about psionics is its being distinct from magic, and this set of powers breaks that almost entirely, as well as breaking the setting.
Fwiw, everyone should please just go to the google drive doc above (free), but the system lives on DriveThruRpg as well.
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/551595/the-way-revised-actually-functional-psionics